The Ten Commandments in Schools

[Repliku]

Since we are on the Christian debate lately, I thought I'd bring up something that annoys me to no end. It is bad enough to me that some Court houses in the south have the 10 Commandments outside of the buildings, but when someone wants to put them in public schools for kids, that's where I draw the line.

The reasons to me are clear, and to a Christian, I would think they would be too, but fundamentalists won't see it that way. I'll explain the point of view below and I welcome opinions on why someone might think either way.

The 10 Commandments:

#1 Thou shalt have no other gods before me".

Well, I want this in a school with kids of all sorts of cultural diversity! Basically this is saying that you can't believe in anyone else above God. The punishments for it were also quite strict and found in the Bible.

Deuteronomy 17:1-5 “And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heavens, which I have not commanded. Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing and shalt stone them with stones, till they die”.

Exodus 22:20 “He that sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the Lord only, he shall be utterly destroyed”.

and New Testament: Mark 16:16 “He that believeth not, shall be damned”.

This is unjustified and against our very constitution which allows Freedom of Religion. It also encourages a reason for some kids to bully others, mistreat them and low and behold if one was an uber Bible-thumper...it gives permission to kill.

#2 “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water below.”

This is a good one. So all the people who wear crosses, fishes, have pictures of Jesus or sculptures, paintings of heaven scenarios etc are sinners. So why are true Christians wandering around with this stuff? Also, this was used as an excuse to deal with a golden sculpture of a cow...so apparently having any symbolism of any other religion is also bad.

Deuteronomy 27: 1 5 “Cursed be the man that maketh any graven or molten image.”

I think this one harms everyone in school and the country, doesn't it?

#3 Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord in vain”.

Well, shucky darn, gosh darn it! So no one should ever say anything of the Lord's name in vain or...

Old Testament
Leviticus 24:16 “And he that blasphemeth the name of the Lord, he shall surely be put to death”

New Testament
Matthew 12:32 “Whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come”.

Mark 3:29 - “He that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation”.

I don't know about others, but I really find it inappropriate to fill my kid's head with the thoughts of eternal damnation, killing etc all for a slip of the tongue. I'd rather my kid be in school learning the critical thing called 'education' rather than fearing what they hear and getting mad at others who do something like that.

#4 Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy”

Seems such a fine thing for a Christian to remember. Of course again, we aren't all Christian. Some of us don't care about a holy day to a deity we disbelieve in. If Christians want to recognize it, fine.

Exodus 31:15 “Whosoever shall work in the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death”.

Once again, death is mentioned. Do you know how many kids will fear working on a Sunday because it is supposed to be so important but yet MANY Americans do that and it is required in some jobs? The Bible doesn't match up with what is really demanding from businesses today, but I don't see people being allowed to kill others for this violation.

#5 “Honour thy father and thy mother”.

This one looks innocent enough. Of course you want to respect your parents. They brought you to life, take care of you, feed you, clothe you etc. However, what happens if say the parents are abusive and some kid cusses him or her out? What happens if a kid needs to get away?

Exodus 21:17 “And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death”

Well, there's that death threat again. I know just off this one I'm probably going to hell because I fought to be free of a very abusive and insane mother. Oh well.

#6 Thou shalt not kill”. which is really "Thou shalt not murder".

Murder in the Bible is considered to be a heinous crime. However, killing in the name of God is not. Any death not condoned by God is murder. The Bible is laced with 'killing' in the name of God. However, Cain murdered his brother Abel. See the difference? Due to the fact the other Commandments seem to say the threat of death often, I don't think I want kids to learn it's okay to kill someone for not believing in God or wearing a cross etc, but it's wrong to kill someone for being a bully, as long as they are Christian. Mixed messages.

#7 “Thou shalt not commit adultery”.

These are kids. It's fine to say to a kid, you shouldn't cheat on a spouse later on in life when he or she is married, but why are elementary kids caring about this at all? Now say a kid does know a parent or uncle or aunt or older person doing the naughty deed?

Leviticus 20:10 “And the man that committeth adultery with another man’s wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall be put to death”.

Egads, killing, yet again! Why are Christian fundies so worried about video games and violent music etc when everything that is said in the very 10 Commandments and throughout the Bible is an excuse to KILL someone?

#8 "Thou shalt not steal".

This is a good one to put up. Sure, it's not nice that someone goes around stealing and that happens in school all too often. The punishment for stealing was often losing the offending limb but also...

Deuteronomy 5:19 "Neither thieves, nor the greedy . . ., nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God"

Well, this one isn't so bad since all it's saying is you will never make it into Heaven. Of course again, for those who aren't Christian, why would they care?

#9 "Thou shalt not bear false witness".

This implies you should not lie, basically. If asked something, you should be honest. However, this has gone so far to say that if you think a 'false thought' you can condemn yourself to Hell. All in all, to tell the truth is a great thing but again, punishments for it were death, especially under oath. Mainly though it was this:

"Neither shall you bear false witness against your neighbour".

Which is found in Deuteronomy as well as Exodus. So what it's saying is that you should not set up someone for a fall and lie to get that person in trouble. It's not telling someone he or she can't lie about other stuff. Just don't screw someone else over with a lie and false story.

#10 "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house".
"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife".

I place both of these together since in some Christian groups they are separated and in others, together. Now, why does a kid care about someone's wife? Kids are going to school to learn. Most aren't thinking about being envious over someone else's wife. They'd rather if they are of age, look at the girls around them. Seems fine that adults out of school can look at these nubile precious kids and yet there has to be protection for some man's wife and property.

"You shall not covet your neighbour’s house; you shall not covet your neighbour’s wife, or male or female slave, or ox, or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbour."

This is the whole meaning of what was implied here. You are not supposed to desire that which another man has. This is somewhat outdated anymore as most of the time we can just go get something at the store a friend might have that we want, such as a video game etc. However, apparently you shouldn't even be thinking that. In the end though, this one is not so bad either. However, the punishment for jealousy/envy and a desire for something someone else owns was death too.

Lastly, some will debate some of these I have placed in here are from the Old Testament, though I posted a few New Testament ones too. However, here's what Jesus had to say on the 10 Commandments.

Romans 1 :29-32 “Those filled with unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, backbiters, hate for god, despite, proud, boasters, inventions of evil things, disobedience to parents, without understanding, covenant breakers, unnatural affection, implacable or unmerciful nature: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death”.

No one to me deserves the right to say who has a choice to live or die unless that person is an actual harm to others as in killing someone else or raping. Rapists aren't even put on death row.

There's my argument why I think the 10 Commandments should NEVER be posted in public schools. I can't complain about Christian schools, because the schools are focused on Christians teaching Christians. It's not my place to make such a judgment call. However, public schools are for anyone to go to and with that in mind, these Commandments have no place on walls.

I had an idea sometime ago that perhaps if Christians wanted to do that so badly, why don't they offer up to also post other religious beliefs like the Buddhist 8-Fold Path or the Hindu Dharma but of course, this idea was always shut down. The reason why is clear, because nothing else is going to stand up to the 10 Commandments, which tells people to follow them or you will die. Others just don't cut it with all that said. My apologies for the long post but eh, I was long winded and wanted to get the thoughts out there as I saw them.

[8730]

I have always believed that if a school is run by the state then it should be as neutral as possible. If it has to be politically neutral, why shouldn't it be religiously neutral? I think that force feeding children religion is wrong as how are they supposed to make an unbiased and informed decision on what faith they want to follow? Also, if religion is going to be taught ALL religions should be mentioned, otherwise it is biased and therefore unfair.

[iwantedtoexplode]

I could probably write a lengthy and articulate response, but it is much easier(and for you, probably more entertaining) for me to post this video. It's not exactly on topic, but it definantly relates, and may help other people with their comments.

CONTAINS STRONG LANGUAGE! WATCH AT YOUR OWN RISK!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CitfTtMIx8

[he's-got-a-heart]

Somehow, I doubt strongly that they will ever do this anyway. Maybe in Christian schools but certainly not state schools.

The day I actually see some people take the 10Cs without offense I'll cry 'Hallelujah!!'. There is no way they would ever allow this.

And please, let's not shovel the blame on Christain's here as we always do. Christainity is not the only faith which uses the 10Cs.

As for 10Cs outside court bulidings, well that's just traditional I guess. Many court buildings are centuries old. Just like the whole oath thing. But I predict that within a few years these shall be gone. After all, people are getting so offended by them. I think the 10Cs where put there tradtionally since a lot of the laws were based upon the 10 commandments in the first place. So what is the harm in having them there? Are traditional Christain-based things gonna be plucked out just because they offend people? :sideways:

[HellKitten]

Yeah, well, I go to catholic school, and I don't believe in God anymore. They pressured me to much and everything is death. If a 12-year-old has better words of wisdom than God, than who is the true justice? They don't even allow you to show you are a proud catholic, apparently? Here is what I follow, and what I will always follow opposed to death for every wrong act commited.

You're being stupid, just as bad as the person of whom comitted such a horrible act. Should we not have hearts to forgive? Thats what kindness is isn't it? No matter how you put it, murder, is not Justice. Kindness is, even if this world has changed, and there is no such thing as Hand-In-Hand love, I will make that change. I will make sure kindness gets to everyone, my options will not change even though God will say I deserve to be tortured to death, my options will not turn against me! I won't back down, even if I'm sent to Hell, I know I will not die in vain.

Actually, I made that up. I will die knowing it was not in vain. The Commandments are wrong, we shall not be put to death for small mistakes. I take no friend whom mercissly takes another's life, for money, fun, or because they hate them. There is no right to kill them unless they themselves try to kill you.

[Ghetto]

I am a christian but i say that in apublic school where people of many religions and backgrounds come together they should not have those commandments.
I follow them but one thing makes me sayno to them in public school. its public. that means we shouldnt force a religion on some one. In a private school you can do that because its private. the owners can choose who to let in and what to put. if you dont like it there go public.

[Darkwatch]

The 10 commandments always bugged the **** outta me.

IMO, they're all completely bull****ted and contradicting.

Watch this video for comedic reference. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=9CitfTtMIx8)

Or this one. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=eBGIQ7ZuuiU)

On a side note, I think everything regarding religion vs. 10 commandments is a giant hypocritic, political scheme. Even in religion we still see people lied to, not just the government.

[iwantedtoexplode]

The 10 commandments always bugged the **** outta me.

IMO, they're all completely bull****ted and contradicting.

Watch this video for comedic reference. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=9CitfTtMIx8)

Or this one. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=eBGIQ7ZuuiU)

On a side note, I think everything regarding religion vs. 10 commandments is a giant hypocritic, political scheme. Even in religion we still see people lied to, not just the government.

Hate to tell you, but I beat ya to it.

[Darkwatch]

Damn it. xD

Oh well.

[Mirai]

I think the 10Cs where put there tradtionally since a lot of the laws were based upon the 10 commandments in the first place.

No they weren't. EVERY civilization even before writing has had rules like "Don't kill" or "Don't steal." It's human nature.

So what is the harm in having them there? Are traditional Christain-based things gonna be plucked out just because they offend people? :sideways:

No, because America is not based on Christianity.

[Darkwatch]

There is no right to kill them unless they themselves try to kill you.

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.

[iwantedtoexplode]

An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.

And you beat me to that(or something to that effect) now we're even.

[Repliku]

Somehow, I doubt strongly that they will ever do this anyway. Maybe in Christian schools but certainly not state schools.

The day I actually see some people take the 10Cs without offense I'll cry 'Hallelujah!!'. There is no way they would ever allow this.

And please, let's not shovel the blame on Christain's here as we always do. Christainity is not the only faith which uses the 10Cs.

As for 10Cs outside court bulidings, well that's just traditional I guess. Many court buildings are centuries old. Just like the whole oath thing. But I predict that within a few years these shall be gone. After all, people are getting so offended by them. I think the 10Cs where put there tradtionally since a lot of the laws were based upon the 10 commandments in the first place. So what is the harm in having them there? Are traditional Christain-based things gonna be plucked out just because they offend people? :sideways:

The harm, if you think about it is because it is hypocritical if you think about it. The 10 Commandments in their cute abbreviated version are posted outside of court houses when court houses represent OUR legal system which does NOT follow it if you think about it.

People steal - what happens? They go to jail and/or pay a fine.
People lie - what happens? They go to jail and/or pay a fine.
People rape, abuse, beat on each other, burglarize, commit adultery - they do not get the death sentence. Adultery won't even get you in jail at all. It's just an assistant when it comes as a reason to getting a divorce.

The only thing someone can really do to get the death sentence is kill. We've had nut jobs kill 'in the name of God' and they still did the crime and may or may not get a death sentence based on which state they are in and if there is even a death row there.

So that is why to me it is hypocritical. It should not be posted since it is not being even adhered to or followed as 'God willed' for the monotheistic religions. If I post rules at a work place, school, etc I'd expect those rules to be adhered to. Our courts to me look laughable by putting the 10 Commandments there for that reason more so than any actual 'religious' debate.

[Zandyne]

(I'm probably not the best person to comment on this, but I'll make the best of it.)

The main beef with rules from so long ago is that THEY do not change, but rather the people around them that interprets them changes. Another thing to consider from the 10C is that they were written in a time where not everyone was literate, which of course meant passing the 'word' by voice and whatnot. People also weren't that terrible techincal. We humans have a tendency to manipulate rules in our favor whenever possible by playing on the ignorance of others.

Now as for the current day 10C.....course its a load of BS, it should be abolished from anywhere that is publically part of the community except from maybe the "happy homes of fundies" (because really people should all be allowed their cup of tea as long as they are harmless).

And then there is of course the (one of my favorites actually) possibility that whoever "wrote" the bible was not a very logical person or group of people, whichever. -I would name examples but I'm sure someone would be offended, and we can't have that (FOR FEAR OF DEATH).

Lastly, as you already know, but I'll state it anyway...its "unconstitutional" for any public school to publically "favor" or try to lean kids into any religion. Course that works better on paper then it does in practice. :\

[he's-got-a-heart]

No they weren't. EVERY civilization even before writing has had rules like "Don't kill" or "Don't steal." It's human nature.


No, not 'EVERY' civilization did one bit in some you did what you need to survive and that was that, whether you stole, killed or sacrificed to get it. And before I get my head bitten off, no I am not implying that nations without the 10Cs were primative/barbaric or anything not even the nations with them followed them properly and they all had their fair share of atrious acts.




No, because America is not based on Christianity.

America?? Huh? I wasn't even talking about America (or is it the US?) I was talking about the UK where I live, which is a nation traditionally based on Christianity. And, so the laws where based on the 10Cs. Wow, some Americans sure do seem to hate Christians, or all religion come to think of it. They'd sooner burn down the schools than have the 10Cs on them so your worries are over.

Hmmmm, yeah America is not traditionally Christian. A nation all about the people right? All the more reason why they ain't gonna stick the 10Cs outside no school building. So no probs. It wouldn't even happen in my country let alone yours.

And for the last time every one, the 10Cs are not exclusively the Christians so stop blaming it on them. Oh, but wait, of course its the Christians' faults. Those bloodythirsty-judgemental-corrupt-loons. Tell 'em where to shove them evil evil evil evil commandments? Right?

The 10 commandments always bugged the **** outta me.

IMO, they're all completely bull****ted and contradicting.

Watch this video for comedic reference. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=9CitfTtMIx8)

Or this one. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=eBGIQ7ZuuiU)

On a side note, I think everything regarding religion vs. 10 commandments is a giant hypocritic, political scheme. Even in religion we still see people lied to, not just the government.

The only thing 'comedic' about this is you.

I assume you are atheist, no?

Well then why should the 10 commandments even concern you? Bug the [offensive slander] out of you? But wait a minute, God doesn't even exist, right?

What harm can the 10Cs stuck outside a building do if God doesn't even exist? None. If we all fall into an etenity dark emptyness when we die anyway, no praises for good things and no punishment for the bad. Zilch.

So why is everyone getting so wound up over nothing anyway? It will never happen. Christians are more likely to be snipered off one by one than that. Now that wouldn't surprise me at all.

PS Oh no it's you of all the people DW I never even realised don't ban me I know I keep on stepping on your toes :-(

The harm, if you think about it is because it is hypocritical if you think about it. The 10 Commandments in their cute abbreviated version are posted outside of court houses when court houses represent OUR legal system which does NOT follow it if you think about it.

People steal - what happens? They go to jail and/or pay a fine.
People lie - what happens? They go to jail and/or pay a fine.
People rape, abuse, beat on each other, burglarize, commit adultery - they do not get the death sentence. Adultery won't even get you in jail at all. It's just an assistant when it comes as a reason to getting a divorce.

The only thing someone can really do to get the death sentence is kill. We've had nut jobs kill 'in the name of God' and they still did the crime and may or may not get a death sentence based on which state they are in and if there is even a death row there.

So that is why to me it is hypocritical. It should not be posted since it is not being even adhered to or followed as 'God willed' for the monotheistic religions. If I post rules at a work place, school, etc I'd expect those rules to be adhered to. Our courts to me look laughable by putting the 10 Commandments there for that reason more so than any actual 'religious' debate.

Death sentence?? Woah, I can't believe that. And they go on about the Bible having an 'eye for a eye' well lemme tell ya is that not what your legal system has too and yet they say 'don't murder' (of course killing is illegal in the US), yes? So now someone step forward and admit how the justice system is hypocritical as well.

OK, look let me introduce a key figure in Christianity: who else but Jesus Christ. Christians (are meant to) follow his teachings above all: Duh. And sorry to be a biblebasher (any other names you want to call me guys? It's so fun to poke the stick at Christians. Come on, roll up, roll up!) but Jesus said that an eye for a eye was 'BS' as you might put it. So please don't make us out to be monsters all of the time.

Unless you happen to work in a church or in Vatican City Repliku the 10 commandments will not be put up let alone followed.

[Mirai]

No, not 'EVERY' civilization did one bit in some you did what you need to survive and that was that, whether you stole, killed or sacrificed to get it. And before I get my head bitten off, no I am not implying that nations without the 10Cs were primative/barbaric or anything not even the nations with them followed them properly and they all had their fair share of atrious acts.

Well, most did. If they did not, the family of the victim would kill the murderer out of anger. Egypt, ofcourse is the oldest living country, and they've always had rules like that.

Morals are necessary for social animals to survive.


America?? Huh? I wasn't even talking about America (or is it the US?) I was talking about the UK where I live, which is a nation traditionally based on Christianity.

My bad. :P Didn't think of that. I do agree however, the UK was originally based on the Commandments, except a few (in the Middle Ages, they must have thought "Thou shalt not kill" meant "Thou shalt not kill, unless the victim believes in a different God than you").


Wow, some Americans sure do seem to hate Christians, or all religion come to think of it. They'd sooner burn down the schools than have the 10Cs on them so your worries are over.

WHOAH! WHOAH! WHOAH! DON'T HIT BELOW THE BELT MAN! I have NEVER claimed that I hate ANY religion, AT ALL. I have a lot of respect for people with religion.

And, most secular humanists would NEVER stoop to acts of violence like that.

The reason that I do not want the 10C's in school in the US, is because it was not based on the 10C's. If it was, #1 on the 10C's when violated when they wrote the first Ammendment.


Hmmmm, yeah America is not traditionally Christian. A nation all about the people right? All the more reason why they ain't gonna stick the 10Cs outside no school building. So no probs. It wouldn't even happen in my country let alone yours.

The evangelical power is growing here.


And for the last time every one, the 10Cs are not exclusively the Christians so stop blaming it on them. Oh, but wait, of course its the Christians' faults. Those bloodythirsty-judgemental-corrupt-loons. Tell 'em where to shove them evil evil evil evil commandments? Right?

Last time I checked, it is only the Christians who are trying to force their religion here in America (without violence, anyway).

BTW, I am not judgemental. However, you may be judgemental, for you assumed that I hate Christians. I only dislike it when SOME (I am capitalizing it to emphasize the amount. Not accusing) Christians try to force their religion above others.



Well then why should the 10 commandments even concern you? Bug the [offensive slander] out of you? But wait a minute, God doesn't even exist, right?

It concerns him because people are trying to put the 10C's in schools, where they DO NOT belong.

[he's-got-a-heart]

Yeah, well, I go to catholic school, and I don't believe in God anymore. They pressured me to much and everything is death. If a 12-year-old has better words of wisdom than God, than who is the true justice? They don't even allow you to show you are a proud catholic, apparently? Here is what I follow, and what I will always follow opposed to death for every wrong act commited.

You're being stupid, just as bad as the person of whom comitted such a horrible act. Should we not have hearts to forgive? Thats what kindness is isn't it? No matter how you put it, murder, is not Justice. Kindness is, even if this world has changed, and there is no such thing as Hand-In-Hand love, I will make that change. I will make sure kindness gets to everyone, my options will not change even though God will say I deserve to be tortured to death, my options will not turn against me! I won't back down, even if I'm sent to Hell, I know I will not die in vain.

Actually, I made that up. I will die knowing it was not in vain. The Commandments are wrong, we shall not be put to death for small mistakes. I take no friend whom mercissly takes another's life, for money, fun, or because they hate them. There is no right to kill them unless they themselves try to kill you.

You don't believe in God....

Even if you're sent to Hell....

Were's the sense in that? No God. No Hell. In that case you have nothing to worry about. So why the rant, eh?

You go on as if somewhere you do believe there is a God but hey he hates me and I hate him, something is making you bitter....

No God doesn't hate you. And no the world is not against you.

Yes it is your choice alone to believe what you want but if God doesn't exist why the anger? Over something, which isn't even there.

Well, most did. If they did not, the family of the victim would kill the murderer out of anger. Egypt, ofcourse is the oldest living country, and they've always had rules like that.

Morals are necessary for social animals to survive.



My bad. :P Didn't think of that. I do agree however, the UK was originally based on the Commandments, except a few (in the Middle Ages, they must have thought "Thou shalt not kill" meant "Thou shalt not kill, unless the victim believes in a different God than you").



WHOAH! WHOAH! WHOAH! DON'T HIT BELOW THE BELT MAN! I have NEVER claimed that I hate ANY religion, AT ALL. I have a lot of respect for people with religion.

And, most secular humanists would NEVER stoop to acts of violence like that.

The reason that I do not want the 10C's in school in the US, is because it was not based on the 10C's. If it was, #1 on the 10C's when violated when they wrote the first Ammendment.



The evangelical power is growing here.



Last time I checked, it is only the Christians who are trying to force their religion here in America (without violence, anyway).

BTW, I am not judgemental. However, you may be judgemental, for you assumed that I hate Christians. I only dislike it when SOME (I am capitalizing it to emphasize the amount. Not accusing) Christians try to force their religion above others.




It concerns him because people are trying to put the 10C's in schools, where they DO NOT belong.

Yeah 'many' is more like it not 'EVERY'.

I only said the laws were based on the 10Cs, not they are the 10Cs.

I'm sorry if I'm going below the belt or whatever but you do have a funny way of showing your respect for religion what with yout siggies and all if you do truly respect us why not leave it be? After all, there is no God in your mind so why even bother? No, I wasn't been judgemental it seems to be everyone else who has this terrible problem with anything and everything that the Christians say and in all truth, God forgive me, but I am getting very fed up with it: hence the mile-long rant. Not exactly WWJD but I never came along and said I was perfect. Do people think we are snobs or something???

Acts of violence like what? Yes in the olden days Christian may have been riding around with swords and scattering gunpowder here are there but lets step forwards to the 21st century. The Christians are no more violent than the secular section so I won't have that.

As I keep repeating in parrot-fashion, the 10Cs will never make their way into your schools. Certainly not the state schools.

Evangelical Christianity spreading? Maybe, one section of the Christians is spreading but what about the rest? There are more Atheists than ever, the world is more 'ungodly' as we BBs say than ever. Just because you were baptised as a baby at 3 months or went to Sunday school from the age of 10-14 doesn't make your a Christain. The stats are a far cry from reality

Oh wow, now the Christians are going for World Domination. 'EVERY' religion seeks to spread, Christian or not. Just because one is spreading quicker than the other doesn't mean that one happens to the be one with the leaders riding in army tanks and planning how be rid of sinners from the face of the Earth.

In my country A FEW people want Shirah law enforcing. Do I march around blowing the trumpet and bad mouthing all Muslims and taking the mick with witless youtube parodies?? No. I simply step aside and don't add fuel to the fire. Because I know and you know it will never happen. The end.

[HellKitten]

[COLOR="Yellow"]You don't believe in God....

Even if you're sent to Hell....

Were's the sense in that? No God. No Hell. In that case you have nothing to worry about. So why the rant, eh?

You go on as if somewhere you do believe there is a God but hey he hates me and I hate him, something is making you bitter....

No God doesn't hate you. And no the world is not against you.
I never said the world is against me. Even if I'm sent to Hell? Well, I'm twelve, and I could be wrong when I say their is no God, which means I can still be sent to Hell. God, I think can just be a force of nature, not an old guy or a young guy.

By the looks of it God gets angry at people for small things. They way the Catholic School's treat me, the way the Church treats me and how they act. If there was a God whom made Commandments, shouldn't he be able to stop what has happened in the past? It would've saved a lot of Jews if God did exist in WWII. Or thousands of Black People when there was Slavery.

If he created earth, why can't he stop a war? Why would he leave it up to Humans to "control" the world? The way we act, makes us lower than low.

The way things have gone so far, makes a wall seem more responsible than us. I think I have some good reasons not to forgive "God". He's put terrible people on earth, if he does exist then. I have a good reason to be bitter towards him.

He should be allowed to control people, because he supposedly put us on earth. He gave the commandments? Why would he give commandements if he has enough power to tell a person what to do? If he's able to send someone in a dream to tell that person what to do. Anyway's there isn't anything in history that has proof thhat most of that stuff that God did existed. Except the commandments but they don't know another person could've just wrote that down?
Sorry, I got off-topic but I just get carried away.

[8730]

The main problem is that not everyone in any one county is of a certain religion so putting up things like the 10C outside public schools and courtrooms is technically discrimination against all other faiths (and non-faiths).

As for my problems with the Church, I think that it is wrong to try and convert people actively, it doesn't address it's violent and sometimes bloody past (a lot of which has been supressed if the Church didn't agree with it), religion is used as a reason for people to do what they want (and I'm not saying all) and there are very few (if any >_>) true followers of any faith, making most hypocrites.

As for God not helping, to me that means God is uncaring/indifferent/cruel/not everywhere at once/not all powerful/non-existant. Forcing us to live on Earth if heaven exists is cruel enough as it is with.

I created a new saying "For God so loved the world, that he wiped all knowledge of Him from the minds of humanity so that they could get on with their lives in peace."

[Darkwatch]

Yes it is your choice alone to believe what you want but if God doesn't exist why the anger? Over something, which isn't even there.Because this "God" is completely taking over the media, the United States, and it's causing countless of people to become completely stupid about. It's distracting people from completely realizing they are HUMAN BEINGS. They are alive. They are not to be played nor to play others. They are not this or that, they are human.

We have VALUE. Humans have an unbelievable bond with nature and still politicians and higher figures continue to segregate us from something so great. Something we CAME from--nature. And it angers people when countless of people are lost to something that really doesn't exist (religion). And I stand firm by the fact that everything that Christianity stands by is a myth. If you don't believe me then look up some documents and documentaries on the truth behind Jesus Christ. Then tell me that it's real.

/endrant.exe

I just realized this was off topic. <_< ignore this post.

[he's-got-a-heart]

I never said the world is against me. Even if I'm sent to Hell? Well, I'm twelve, and I could be wrong when I say their is no God, which means I can still be sent to Hell. God, I think can just be a force of nature, not an old guy or a young guy.

By the looks of it God gets angry at people for small things. They way the Catholic School's treat me, the way the Church treats me and how they act. If there was a God whom made Commandments, shouldn't he be able to stop what has happened in the past? It would've saved a lot of Jews if God did exist in WWII. Or thousands of Black People when there was Slavery.

If he created earth, why can't he stop a war? Why would he leave it up to Humans to "control" the world? The way we act, makes us lower than low.

The way things have gone so far, makes a wall seem more responsible than us. I think I have some good reasons not to forgive "God". He's put terrible people on earth, if he does exist then. I have a good reason to be bitter towards him.

He should be allowed to control people, because he supposedly put us on earth. He gave the commandments? Why would he give commandements if he has enough power to tell a person what to do? If he's able to send someone in a dream to tell that person what to do. Anyway's there isn't anything in history that has proof thhat most of that stuff that God did existed. Except the commandments but they don't know another person could've just wrote that down?
Sorry, I got off-topic but I just get carried away.

You say just because you are 12 years ols you may be wrong about God not existing... Well by saying that you saying you could be wrong about anything. The point is, at the moment your mind is made up that he doesn't exist. You might believe in God one day or you might not but let's please talk about the present not maybe this or maybe that.

OK what I am about to say here is my opinion: No open your eyes and see that it's Catholic Church gets angry at you for small things, not God. Man, they wanna take over the world or whatever of course they're gonna be strict how else can they get around people? I've been to Catholic school all my life just like you I'm 17 and still in it. So why am i not angry at God? I never fell for what they told me. Because it is the Catholic Chruch speak all of this not God write that Cathecism book, build million dollar chapels and enforce all those suffocating dogma, all of it being way more in excess of the 10 Commandments ever were. So long as whatever is was, was accidental and you didn't go out of your way to hurt anyone, why would he get angry? I can't believe some people are so naive as to think they are condemned to Hell because they didn't recite the 'Hail Mary' 77 times or didn't make the sign of the Cross before breakfast. Yes, God does get angry at somethings, but all of us religious or not have a little something called a conscience inside us telling us whether we are doing right or wrong anyway. God is just. Not a nit-picker.

Ah, yes. A little off topic I agree but I should have seen this coming: the imperfect God argument. If God is here, why doesn't God come and pick up the pieces? Blame everything on God, etc etc. Every religion/spiritually has a different take on this. Well, are we going to do the norm and point the finger at God or are we as a human race going to rest the blame on the people who start the stuff in the first place? It's so much easier to shove it all on God isn't it. Did God tell Hitler to kill the Jews or Bush to start a war on Iraq?? No. Though, some may say yes. Did God give approval for slavery or was it the Pope? People do terrible things in the name of God and then the atheists come along and tar all of the Christains with the same brush. Oh but because God didn't zap all those warlords with lightning bolts or make sure they were never born in the 1st place it's his fault anyways I'm guessing. Well, as a Christain I can say that something much much worse is going to happen to them.

Humans have free will. The right to choose to follow him or not. And if you choose not to well fine it's your right. He didn't make us into God-fearing puppets or obsessive monks. But free will extends to daily life. So he wont bail anyone out because of any choices that have been made freely. otherwise it wouldn't be free will would it. If God appeared to everyone of us we are all guaranteed to believe in him; it may prove God but that proves nothing about a person and their faith.

You forget that in a Christian's POV we believe in a little something called an afterlife and no matter what befalls us here on Earth we will ultimately be with God in Heaven and there is no power on Earth that could ever separate us from God. That's why some people are persecuted to death for God. And it's not just Christians either it happens in every religion. It's fine for us to sit on our @$$ at home typing into the computer about how oppressed we are as theists or atheists and about the cheek of those Christians and the arrogance of the atheists and how we are all threating each others freedom but we are probably some of the on people in the world who can afford to do that.

[Kaitou Sai]

Okay well after that rather lenghty first post (although intersting to read) I didn't wanna read all the others so this may be repeating others, and also I'm sleep deprived so this may not make sence....but here we go anyways


First off I am appauled at all the death mentioned in it, in my mind the only people that should be killed are child molesters there is no way I could EVER forgive them, I think it is HORRIBLE. As for murderes, unless it is a mass murder then I don't belive they should be killed, after all, people can change giving that they are willing to.

Moving on, you said public schools right? Well that's the thing, they are public and that means anyone can come learn, there are many people with many different belifes. Having such things saying 'folow this or die' in a area where all different kinds of people are going to be around, really dosen't seem right to me.

I didn't point out all that I wanted to say but that's some of the basic stuff that think people should at least take into account.

Sorry, I know I fail at spelling and grammar.

[he's-got-a-heart]

Because this "God" is completely taking over the media, the United States, and it's causing countless of people to become completely stupid about. It's distracting people from completely realizing they are HUMAN BEINGS. They are alive. They are not to be played nor to play others. They are not this or that, they are human.

We have VALUE. Humans have an unbelievable bond with nature and still politicians and higher figures continue to segregate us from something so great. Something we CAME from--nature. And it angers people when countless of people are lost to something that really doesn't exist (religion). And I stand firm by the fact that everything that Christianity stands by is a myth. If you don't believe me then look up some documents and documentaries on the truth behind Jesus Christ. Then tell me that it's real.

/endrant.exe

I just realized this was off topic. <_< ignore this post.

Wow I feel like I'm fighting a war here it's like 10 against 1.

Hmmm yeah maybe it is off topic but at the end of the day it's still belongs in the debate corner so why not discuss it? Sometimes one thing leads to another it's not extremely OT to the point of SPAM.

God is taking over the media? Or is the media trying to take over people's view of God? The only times God appears in the media are:

a) on the God Channel
b) He gets mentionned and there just happens to to be a guy in a mask with a bomb strapped wround his waist
c) To take the P - probably the most common and the saddest type
d) When some loony protesters are plotting the execution of gay politicians
e) When Christians are yet again conspiring to take over the world and threaten the World Order
f) Da Vinci Code, Jesus Christ Superstar, The God Delusion, Bruce Almighty, etc

So in other words in 98% of media coverage God is only put in for atheists to shake their heads in pity or digust for those deluded Christians who reckon that a bloke who lived 100s of years ago died... For what again?

Ha, the media almost has a fear of God. And the reason? Polictical correctness is something to do with it. Publish an article about the works of Jesus (which isn't slandering him) and you've been brainwashed for sure. God just doesn't sell newspapers nor does he create hits on a site. Publish an article about how Jesus was a pimp and had 666 concubines and you've got yourself millions of copies sold and a shiny new promotion.

Stupid about it? What do you mean? You mean extremist or just plain stupid about what they have the right to believe in?

Yes of course Christians realise they are human so you think I look in the mirror and see a halo on top my head? No. Do you think they are really that arrogant? This is what I mean about people tarring all Christians with the same brush. In fact being human is part of what Christianity is all about. Humans: being human is utlimately about making choices between right and wrong, this is what separates us from other life forms. And with choice, comes responsibility. The right to the make mistakes and learn. And in order for this to happen Christians need Jesus. Why do you think he came in the first place? To be a judge or a warrior (as the media might have you swallow)? No. He came to take away our sins because we are human and none of us are perfect. Why would he bother otherwise.

Played against each other? Well it appears as if you have subconsciously been played against others yourself. Again, it is not solely the Christians that do this as much as we might like to believe. This happens in every walk of life whether it be brother vs sister, one school vs another, Catholism vs Protestants or the Western world vs the East and soon to be added Planet Earth vs ET (sad joke thrown in the mix). The main divided on this planet at this moment in time is the West vs the East. Unlike Christian vs atheist it is more likely to cause devasting destruction to mankind. And, they will say this WvsE is Christainity vs Islam, which is not true it is to do with power, money and weapons. What use is God to the government without any weapons or money? No, let's use religion as a cover-up, a fabolous way to divide and conquer since people get so fantical about it. Christians aim to bring more people to Christ and be a witness onto other and sometimes this is peceived as playing X against Y.

Yes, you have a nature-based beliefs that's fine. You believe we came from nature, which is true. Christians believe that nature came from God. So maybe before you start looking at all those differences you should start looking at similarities between us. Christians too should recognise the importance of nature via numious experiences and being able to see God's works and love through what he created. Christians aim to preserve the beautiful things that God has made for us to enjoy. Nature is what he intended for us, not skyscrapers and council estates. So why blame it on the Christians as per usual? Well it is so much easier to blame it all on them, no? You should start blaming the people who are really ripping up the environment i.e. the government what with the growth of economy (that's all they care about, now someone come along and tell me this is all the Christians care about) and the carbon emmisions, rooting up rainforest, driving gas guzzlers and polluting rivers and landfill sites. Please, of all the things do not blame this on the Christians.

If you choose to believe that Christainity is a 'myth' that is your descion (sp?). Now we could take this matter to court and weigh up the evidence: did Jesus even exist or not? Some say there is more proof he lived than Julius Caesar. Others, such as yourself say there is undeniable proof that the guy never even walked the face of the earth never let alone on water. Will we ever really know? No. Not one of us alive knows. Why not? Because if we did wouldn't everyone get up and start converting to Christianity (which would prove nothing to God), or oppositely all Christians ceasing to exist. Christians believe it takes faith to get Heaven as the man himself said 'blessed are those who do not see and yet believe'. What do I say? I believe in Jesus more than the Earth around me, because what I feel inside, whether it be in my head or not, is more real to me than anything around me. So I don't need any science book or bloke with a Ph.D. to come and tell me what is or isn't right. And the same for you I'm guessing ^^ It's all about what you believe inside, not about what's happening on the outside. In other words what's inside of you as a person. And that's where all faiths should link but instead we go around critizing, mocking, denouncing and making implications on what others believe.



Sorry, I know I fail at spelling and grammar.

Me too I'm dyslexic ^_^

You're post is fine.

I'm a Christain who can't even spell Christain. It's either Christain or Christian I dunno.

[Zandyne]

(EDITED POST TO SAVE SOME SPACE)

So in other words in 98% of media coverage God is only put in for atheists to shake their heads in pity or digust for those deluded Christians who reckon that a bloke who lived 100s of years ago died... For what again?

Ha, the media almost has a fear of God. And the reason? Polictical correctness is something to do with it. Publish an article about the works of Jesus (which isn't slandering him) and you've been brainwashed for sure. God just doesn't sell newspapers nor does he create hits on a site. Publish an article about how Jesus was a pimp and had 666 concubines and you've got yourself millions of copies sold and a shiny new promotion.

Yes of course Christians realise they are human so you think I look in the mirror and see a halo on top my head? No. Do you think they are really that arrogant? This is what I mean about people tarring all Christians with the same brush. In fact being human is part of what Christianity is all about. Humans: being human is utlimately about making choices between right and wrong, this is what separates us from other life forms. And with choice, comes responsibility. The right to the make mistakes and learn. And in order for this to happen Christians need Jesus. Why do you think he came in the first place? To be a judge or a warrior (as the media might have you swallow)? No. He came to take away our sins because we are human and none of us are perfect. Why would he bother otherwise.

Played against each other? Well it appears as if you have subconsciously been played against others yourself. Again, it is not solely the Christians that do this as much as we might like to believe. This happens in every walk of life whether it be brother vs sister, one school vs another, Catholism vs Protestants or the Western world vs the East and soon to be added Planet Earth vs ET (sad joke thrown in the mix). The main divided on this planet at this moment in time is the West vs the East. Unlike Christian vs atheist it is more likely to cause devasting destruction to mankind. And, they will say this WvsE is Christainity vs Islam, which is not true it is to do with power, money and weapons. What use is God to the government without any weapons or money? No, let's use religion as a cover-up, a fabolous way to divide and conquer since people get so fantical about it. Christians aim to bring more people to Christ and be a witness onto other and sometimes this is peceived as playing X against Y.

Yes, you have a nature-based beliefs that's fine. You believe we came from nature, which is true. Christians believe that nature came from God. So maybe before you start looking at all those differences you should start looking at similarities between us. Christians too should recognise the importance of nature via numious experiences and being able to see God's works and love through what he created. Christians aim to preserve the beautiful things that God has made for us to enjoy. Nature is what he intended for us, not skyscrapers and council estates. So why blame it on the Christians as per usual? Well it is so much easier to blame it all on them, no? You should start blaming the people who are really ripping up the environment i.e. the government what with the growth of economy (that's all they care about, now someone come along and tell me this is all the Christians care about) and the carbon emmisions, rooting up rainforest, driving gas guzzlers and polluting rivers and landfill sites. Please, of all the things do not blame this on the Christians.

If you choose to believe that Christainity is a 'myth' that is your descion (sp?). Now we could take this matter to court and weigh up the evidence: did Jesus even exist or not? Some say there is more proof he lived than Julius Caesar. Others, such as yourself say there is undeniable proof that the guy never even walked the face of the earth never let alone on water. Will we ever really know? No. Not one of us alive knows. Why not? Because if we did wouldn't everyone get up and start converting to Christianity (which would prove nothing to God), or oppositely all Christians ceasing to exist. Christians believe it takes faith to get Heaven as the man himself said 'blessed are those who do not see and yet believe'. What do I say? I believe in Jesus more than the Earth around me, because what I feel inside, whether it be in my head or not, is more real to me than anything around me. So I don't need any science book or bloke with a Ph.D. to come and tell me what is or isn't right. And the same for you I'm guessing ^^ It's all about what you believe inside, not about what's happening on the outside. In other words what's inside of you as a person. And that's where all faiths should link but instead we go around critizing, mocking, denouncing and making implications on what others believe.


(I HAVE NO IDEA WHERE YOU SPAWNED THIS NOTION, but I will try to answer it anyway.)
The MEDIA does not have a fear of God, the media has a fear of the people. God does not make these people "do these things", people find it in their rationale of what they ASSUME is God's will. But yes, there is a partial obligation that they try to be politically correct, PEOPLE have more power by the mobs and protests then we even give ourselves credit for.

Ok, see this is why "Christians get painted with the same brush" a majority of the ones that "SPEAK UP" TYPICALLY have the same ideas. And the quote that you responded to you did not even say "ALL CHRISTIANS" so please, do not paint all disagreements against your belief as attacks. Also, are you speaking for all Christians? Just a techinical detail question I know, but do you speak for them all?
Now on a more personal note, humans have free will to make themselves good. They do not need Jesus or any other religious figure to do so....DID YOU KNOW THAT PEOPLE COULD EVEN LOOK TO OTHER, EVEN LIVING, PEOPLE TO IMPROVE THEMSELVES? Just thought I would throw that out there.
P/S: At the apocolypse, Jesus is supposed to be a warrior who SLAYS all of the remaining wrong-doers (this includes non-believers; so kind for a savior). :\

I find it terribly ironic that you cannot find the truth in your own statement about "God (or more accurately, religion) being used as a coverup". If you demand an army, why not use a "common lie", it appears to be working quite WELL. Why, almost like any RELIGION vs ANY DIFFERING BELIEF inspired war out there (REF TO THE CRUSADES for a past example!).

Oh please, cease this "Don't blame us Christians again as per usual." Any on-topics of this thread don't blame Christians for things like say, GLOBAL WARMING. So, once more, though this REALLY sounds insulting despite my intentions, do not play the "victim" here. (You can easily call yourself the minority in this thread however, as that is accurate, but please....no "Christians are victims!") :\
Once again you're using that "Christians do this and do that", YOU just finished saying "You can't lump all Christians together" yet you're doing it. But anyway, the point here is that your "statement" is not entirely true. And if what you say WAS true (about the preservation of enviornments and such), well, WHY ON EARTH do you "Christians" BUILD such GRANDIOSE CHURCHES?! Churches aren't exactly divined into existence you know, so please clarify on this "preserving nature" that you speak of. (As well as all these "graven images" Repliku pointed out at some point- whatever happened to the self being the holiest of temples?)
And it was my understanding that you didn't need to be religious to want to preserve nature.
Also, that Government economy "ripping up" you were talking about....talk to the LEGISLATURE and the folks of the country! Also, economy is not talked about at all in the Bible, so "WTF" on that point that "Christians care about the economy". Now if I wanted to blame "Christianity" for anything, I would blame ignorant fundamentalist extremists against their hatred for people of "non-agreeable" sexuality as well as their (selective) "protests" against certain areas of science! But then again, I BLAME THE PERSON. (Think Medicine and Evolution, both are sciences acquired by the same method YET they only aggressively argue against one!)


*Insert what I have previously stated about you referring to yourself in the royal 'we' as 'WE CHRISTIANS"*
I will respect (I use this term LOOSELY) your beliefs, but in RETURN, you must allow a certain freedom for us to CONTINUE choosing our own beliefs and you must cease your public displays of your religion (AS THAT WOULD CERTAINLY BE A BIAS ON OUR CHILDREN/FUTURE GENERATIONS)!
Now if we can come to terms with that, well then we're GOLDEN!

BACK ON TOPIC:
The reason why this is even here is to say that religious FREEDOM is ours to choose. Now in the land that is supposed to be known for its FREEDOM, why should it favor (which it techincally shouldn't) any religion over another? In other words, why should the 10C be present in any PUBLIC school?

Clearly it would be religious bias.

[Repliku]

Wow I feel like I'm fighting a war here it's like 10 against 1.

Hmmm yeah maybe it is off topic but at the end of the day it's still belongs in the debate corner so why not discuss it? Sometimes one thing leads to another it's not extremely OT to the point of SPAM.

God is taking over the media? Or is the media trying to take over people's view of God? The only times God appears in the media are:

a) on the God Channel
b) He gets mentionned and there just happens to to be a guy in a mask with a bomb strapped wround his waist
c) To take the P - probably the most common and the saddest type
d) When some loony protesters are plotting the execution of gay politicians
e) When Christians are yet again conspiring to take over the world and threaten the World Order
f) Da Vinci Code, Jesus Christ Superstar, The God Delusion, Bruce Almighty, etc

So in other words in 98% of media coverage God is only put in for atheists to shake their heads in pity or digust for those deluded Christians who reckon that a bloke who lived 100s of years ago died... For what again?

Not to point this out but you are so wrong. Every time there is a tragedy God is mentioned, and people praying to God to save them and the media goes into talking about it and telling people to pray and have hope, or to pray and hope the survivors left behind recover. Watch the coverage on the mining incidents.

Also, on the war, they constantly have zealots that go on the news and say 'the soldiers will burn in Hell for they sin against God' all the time, which yes, you mention. However, others send blessings to the troops. It's all the time on. You must have blinders to not see.

And EVERY holiday, even though the Christians stole them from others, especially Christmas and Easter, we get news media all about Christians, all the work they do and how great they are and how they are sick of hearing people turn it into a universal and store bought holiday of gift giving etc and how that tree is a CHRISTMAS tree instead of a Yule Tree or Holiday tree. We also get to see how the poor Christians go over seas and do so much yet apparently get so little and are martyrs. Those people aren't all Mother Teresas. Christianity is just about daily represented in the news in one way or another. It's on TV, in the paper, on the internet etc.

Ha, the media almost has a fear of God. And the reason? Polictical correctness is something to do with it. Publish an article about the works of Jesus (which isn't slandering him) and you've been brainwashed for sure. God just doesn't sell newspapers nor does he create hits on a site. Publish an article about how Jesus was a pimp and had 666 concubines and you've got yourself millions of copies sold and a shiny new promotion.

The media does not fear God. Some journalists might personally, but mainly the media would fear people and bad ratings, and since quite a few people are Christian in this country, they often are catered to. The other thing most on the media seems to be about celebrities because we all so much care about them for some reason. *yawn*. Perhaps combining that together as you suggested would produce a platinum sale. Found that amusing.

Stupid about it? What do you mean? You mean extremist or just plain stupid about what they have the right to believe in?

Yes of course Christians realise they are human so you think I look in the mirror and see a halo on top my head? No. Do you think they are really that arrogant? This is what I mean about people tarring all Christians with the same brush. In fact being human is part of what Christianity is all about. Humans: being human is utlimately about making choices between right and wrong, this is what separates us from other life forms. And with choice, comes responsibility. The right to the make mistakes and learn. And in order for this to happen Christians need Jesus. Why do you think he came in the first place? To be a judge or a warrior (as the media might have you swallow)? No. He came to take away our sins because we are human and none of us are perfect. Why would he bother otherwise.

Please do yourself a favor and don't lump yourself with 'all' Christians. Some are horrible people just like anyone else and just happen to follow a portion of your own beliefs. This doesn't make them good. You aren't a martyr and shouldn't pay for the nastiness of some. You also said Americans would sooner burn down schools than see the 10 Commandments up. This is a slander against many people and rather silly. You may be sick of people slamming Christianity but Christians aren't the martyrs here. You have a lot more followers even if the Christian people can't all get along themselves. The 10 Commandments are horribly violent. They show kids and others the watered down version and not the truth. I don't feel it inaccurate to not want that on a wall to read every day. That doesn't mean people hate Christians. It means that they would cause more violence because Christians would be confused while others are dominated under an oppression of religion in schools that are supposed to be for anyone. Seriously, you have it backwards.

Played against each other? Well it appears as if you have subconsciously been played against others yourself. Again, it is not solely the Christians that do this as much as we might like to believe. This happens in every walk of life whether it be brother vs sister, one school vs another, Catholism vs Protestants or the Western world vs the East and soon to be added Planet Earth vs ET (sad joke thrown in the mix). The main divided on this planet at this moment in time is the West vs the East. Unlike Christian vs atheist it is more likely to cause devasting destruction to mankind. And, they will say this WvsE is Christainity vs Islam, which is not true it is to do with power, money and weapons. What use is God to the government without any weapons or money? No, let's use religion as a cover-up, a fabolous way to divide and conquer since people get so fantical about it. Christians aim to bring more people to Christ and be a witness onto other and sometimes this is peceived as playing X against Y.

There are severe word bashings and sometimes even actions by militant Christian groups though it is downplayed. Of course we don't want Christians looking like terrorists. There are many fanatics and speaking of the war... Bush has used God as a reason why to back American ethics to keep the war going right on the news and to speak on behalf of the fundamentalists groups that are growing. Also, it is an answer to the zealot Islamic groups that hate us so much. I put my God against your God basically. However, he makes sure as do others that the Islamic God normally is the same God as the Christian one when non-extremists worship him. I am not a Christian. I don't want our president or any leader in a position to say something using God as a reason. Our country doesn't make decisions that way and if a leader is a fanatical Christian, he's not representing all of America by being so. We entered this war not for God but for a reason here on earth.

Yes, you have a nature-based beliefs that's fine. You believe we came from nature, which is true. Christians believe that nature came from God. So maybe before you start looking at all those differences you should start looking at similarities between us. Christians too should recognise the importance of nature via numious experiences and being able to see God's works and love through what he created. Christians aim to preserve the beautiful things that God has made for us to enjoy. Nature is what he intended for us, not skyscrapers and council estates. So why blame it on the Christians as per usual? Well it is so much easier to blame it all on them, no? You should start blaming the people who are really ripping up the environment i.e. the government what with the growth of economy (that's all they care about, now someone come along and tell me this is all the Christians care about) and the carbon emmisions, rooting up rainforest, driving gas guzzlers and polluting rivers and landfill sites. Please, of all the things do not blame this on the Christians.

If you choose to believe that Christainity is a 'myth' that is your descion (sp?). Now we could take this matter to court and weigh up the evidence: did Jesus even exist or not? Some say there is more proof he lived than Julius Caesar. Others, such as yourself say there is undeniable proof that the guy never even walked the face of the earth never let alone on water. Will we ever really know? No. Not one of us alive knows. Why not? Because if we did wouldn't everyone get up and start converting to Christianity (which would prove nothing to God), or oppositely all Christians ceasing to exist. Christians believe it takes faith to get Heaven as the man himself said 'blessed are those who do not see and yet believe'. What do I say? I believe in Jesus more than the Earth around me, because what I feel inside, whether it be in my head or not, is more real to me than anything around me. So I don't need any science book or bloke with a Ph.D. to come and tell me what is or isn't right. And the same for you I'm guessing ^^ It's all about what you believe inside, not about what's happening on the outside. In other words what's inside of you as a person. And that's where all faiths should link but instead we go around critizing, mocking, denouncing and making implications on what others believe.

Me too I'm dyslexic ^_^

You're post is fine.

I'm a Christain who can't even spell Christain. It's either Christain or Christian I dunno.

Some Christians do feel that nature is great and we 'need' it but others have gone under the assumption that God gave mankind the Earth to do whatever he wanted with it. It has caused problems. However, some great saints like Saint Francis did herald in some eye openers and were thanked for it later, even if during their lives they were sometimes seen as heretics. There are nature destroyers that are Christian and there are nature destroyers that aren't. In this country, since 80% on polls claim to be Christian of some kind, who is going to be labeled as eco-destroyers? Makes sense the dominant population could make fixes and yet does not all the time, or even as often as the other 20%.

I'm dyslexic too. I am ambidextrous and was forced to write with my right hand when 5 instead of the left I was..so now I use both sides of my brain, am ambidextrous...but dyslexic as hell, especially with numbers. -.- Let's all be slydexic together!

The point comes back to somehow, that was lost, is that in public schools, should the 10 Commandments be posted. The very reason why not is in this whole argument which shows that not everyone is Christian and yet 'some' Christians feel they have not enough representation. There are churches 'everywhere'. There are dry counties in this nation for religious reasons. Why do you feel that they are under represented? Christianity -is- forced on anyone not Christian all the time. So why in public schools? Let alone Judicial places? Why do you keep feeling that Christianity is oppressed, yet it is the one thing oppressing everyone else? It is EVERYWHERE. It's also the fundamental Christians (not all Christians) that are pushing for the 10 Commandments to be in public schools. So what if some of us push back and say no? Why can't we? Why is it every time we ask for equality and fairness it is 'putting Christianity down'? Why do Christians get to play the 'martyr card' when they are the dominant thing around? That's just not right. You may be sick of Christian bashing, but many others are sick of Christians dominating the way people think, eat, drink, watch tv, play video games etc. We aren't the oppressors here.

For those who go to church schools, they can post whatever they want. At public schools, it is clearly a reason to permit bullying, mistreatment and harassment of children that do not see the same way as others. The laws of the 10 Commandments also teach that death is the punishment for nearly any transgression, including cultural diversity. Christianity or any monotheistic religion isn't 'BAD' to me. Some followers though are. However, I fail to see how any other religion is bad either, or not believing in a religion is the biggest sin, and that is what the doctrines of the monotheistic religions say clearly, in the 10 Commandments, and Jesus does comment in the New Testament too. If someone said 'let's post the 8-Fold Path of Buddhism on the wall at school, people would be in more of an uproar, even though it is more a 'path' than a religious pursuit.

For someone who is a Christian, they may see no problem in posting something up like this because they see the nicey version and often themselves don't know the stuff completely. This is why I posted the complete version. However, my point is that I stand by my word and if something is posted on a school wall, court house etc, it is a code of rules and laws, correct? So if it is going to be there, it should be followed and adhered word for word and also posted in entirety. If it is not going to be there, then obviously it is followed on a person's ideals, not forced. Otherwise it is just eye candy to make some zealots happy while others have to stare at it and wonder why.

This isn't a bash on Christians or Islamic people or Jews. The simple truth is that not everyone is a monotheistic faith follower and public school means that it is for anyone. If we followed the 10 Commandments word for word, there would be a dramatic decrease in population. If all beliefs cannot be represented, none should.

[Rosey]

If that was posted out my school i would sue.

Because for the people who are not religious or not Christain, that makes us feel bad.

So that should not be allowed to be posted