Birth by Sleep Keyblades at all?

Discussion in 'Kingdom Hearts HD II.5 ReMIX' started by P, Oct 15, 2007.

  1. P Banned

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    Not another, they draw out the keyblade's true form. Read the description for the Kingdom Key keychain.

    Also I did not mindlessly state "Oh, those ones don't have those chains, so they must be weaker!"

    I said that Venn, Terra and Aqua lacked Keychains, and Baldy w/Dark soldier had them. I assume that there is some difference, and the victors of the match, Baldy and the DS, I assume had the stronger weapon. Is that a ridiculous statement? It is idiotic to think that the victor's weapon is better than the loser's, especially when there is a noticeable difference?

    I know the difference as much as you do, but I am certain there is a difference. Also Mickey at the end had a Keyblade, although I am unsure what that means.

    My points stated again. Please say how you find my ideas unworkable next time, instead of rewriting them to make them seem illogical.

    Edit: The Kingdom key was frozen with Sora in Com, by Vexen. Yeah, I know, it doesn't really count.
     
  2. Illusionary Oblivion Merlin's Housekeeper

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    I apologise if that's how I made it sound... It's just that your stressing of the fact of Baldy's and the apprentice's blades having Keychains and Terra's, Ven's and Aqua's not having them is kinda repetitive... but then, I guess that makes me no better.

    I think it's just a little... quick, maybe?... to judge them so quickly. Their weapons look like the Keyblades we know (at very least to a certain extent) sans the whole Keychain thing... We've never even seen the spell Baldy used to freeze Ven, so we don't know if it can break something that couldn't otherwise BE broken, and if you really think about it, the trio are probably still learning at the time the movies are set, while Baldy's a Master.

    Not to mention, maybe Baldy's a very different teacher to Terra's/Ven's/Aqua's? We don't know... Maybe there's just a very big difference between how they're taught and how the apprentice is... (hence why he kicked their butts)?

    I don't know... but hey, it's just a theory.
     
  3. KeybladeSpirit [ENvTuber] [pngTuber]

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    This is my theory.

    Terra, Aqua, Ven, and Master Xehanort(AKA: Unknown Elder Mage(AKA: UCM(AKA:Baldy))) were all trainee Keyblade masters, being trained by King Mickey. This battle was basicly a training battle gone horribly wrong. Not to mention, in the first part, Master Xehanort's Keyblade didn't have a Keychain. My guess is that when a Keyblade Master becomes as powerful as he can get, his Keyblade "evolves" into its true form with a Keychain. Now I bet you're thinking, "But Sora's Keyblade already had a Keychain." Well, he probably trained enough from playfighting with Riku, therefore his Keyblade already had its Keychain. Anyway, back to Terra, Aqua, Ven, and Master Xehanort. Master Xehanort reached his full potential long before the battle, and hid it so that when this training battle came, as he knew it would), he could destroy all his competition so that he could get control of Kingdom Hearts. Right when he thought that he had succeeded, Aqua and Ven's love teleported him to the streets of Hollow Bastion, only remembering the name Xehanort. Ok that was a joke. :lol: Okay here's the real version of the last sentence.

    Right when he thought that he had succeeded, a final defense system planted in Kingdom Hearts both
    1. Destroyed itself.
    and
    2. Teleported Master Xehanort to the streets of Hollow Bastion, remembering only the name Xehanort.

    The King was disapointed that he didn't realize that this would happen.
     
  4. P Banned

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    Eh, your theory works, but it seems a bit too broad for my likings. You seem to have just taken the shell and crafted your theory around it, while the theory should fit and be wrapped around the facts.

    Oh, and Illusionary Oblivion, I might believe that it was a special spell, but it seemed so... Casual. Baldy did not grab Ven's weapon and start pumping magic into it until it breaks, he just froze Ven and chucked him off a cliff.

    Also the blades Terra, Ven and Aqua use look a lot like the blades scattered and dead in the battle field. It seems as the battlefield blades are inferior to Keychained blades, as they died, while there are no keychained blades there.

    Stressing the point of the keychains may be repetitive, but it is the only obvious difference that I can see. As such I must cling to that one difference. Besides, keychains seem like they will play an important role.

    I am still sticking to my guns that Keychains make the keyblade. For this I have no proof, but from what I have seen in that battle, Keychained blades are the minority, and the minority kicked the Majority's butt.

    It may be too early to tell, but the point I am trying to make is that when all of this is over, it will turn out that there is a major difference between Keychained and Keychainless blades.

    Do you disagree?
     
  5. Illusionary Oblivion Merlin's Housekeeper

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    Not completely. It just seems to me that it just may be looking too far into it. *shrugs* That's your theory, though, and I really do have to respect you for sticking to it like you are.

    My take on things is as I've said before... That Keychains are means for blades to act/look etc like others... it's quite possible that they'd be more powerful than blades that don't have Keychains (you know... a double-up of power or something... their power and the power of the other blade). That, to me, could explain one reason why Baldy kicked their butts (or it could just be that the trio ARE students going up against a master...) and still work -a bit- with your ideas.
     
  6. Lord Knight Xiron Hollow Bastion Committee

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    Wow. This is still going on? Hahah..

    Well, I still say they are keyblades. So far, the only thing we've seen that wasn't a real keyblade but wasn't was Riku's Soul Eater, which then became the Way to Dawn. But Soul Eater wasn't anywhere as close to looking like a Keyblade as the 3 Knights' weapons. The only other example is the Soul Taker (Rikunort's Dark Keyblade from KH1), which is a real keyblade, but was just created differently than normal keyblades.

    So, since they look like keyblades, have characteristics generally similar to the keyblade, and can be summoned at will (as shown in one of the scans), it has to be something greater than the Soul Eater. If they aren't real keyblades, they are something like Soul Taker or Kairi's Keyblade, which are real keyblades (as far as we know), just created differently. The real defining point will be when we see one of the keyblades Locking/Unlocking something, as that is really the only difference between a Keyblade and something like Soul Eater.
     
  7. P Banned

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    To illusionary Oblivion:

    I have to disagree with your theory, because it seems that most Keychains are made to fit the world, so I assume Keychains are Crafted from memories.

    Also, if your theory was correct, wouldn't the Kingdom key, when first obtained, be a keychainless one?

    To Lord knight Xiron:

    I do consider Soul Taker not "Run of the mill" as it was not the same as the other ones at all!

    Soul Taker I put around the blades Ven and Co. use. The only difference is that Soul taker is crafted from hearts and has some special abilities.

    As for Kairi's blade... I have no idea about that. Until further notice I am going to pretend it does not exist. Just out of interest, did it have a keychain?

    I think that BbS is going to develop the keyblades in an "Ansems report" esque thing.
     
  8. Illusionary Oblivion Merlin's Housekeeper

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    The Kingdom Key, without a Keychain? Hmm... Maybe. After all, if my theory IS correct, maybe the Keyblade Sora has isn't even Kingdom Key? Instead one that 'wears' the Kingdom Key Keychain...

    As for Kairi's Keyblade, yes, it does have a Keychain (it's a paopu, if you're wondering)
     
  9. Twilight's Rose Banned

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    I disagree in some ways of your theory. Aqua, Ven, Terra and MX could't have been teached by Mickey. Mickey was still be teached by Yen Sid the wizard. A apprentice can't teach other apprentice. If Kingdom Hearts was destroyed then why we still see it in KH and KHII?
     
  10. P Banned

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    But why would it be a copy if the Description was "draws out the keyblade's true form and power"?

    Kairi's Keyblade seems to be an odd specimen. We see it once, conjured by Riku. How odd that it is made by Riku rather than Kairi. I will probably make a thread on it.
     
  11. Illusionary Oblivion Merlin's Housekeeper

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    We've been given misleading or incomplete information in the games before. *shrug*
     
  12. P Banned

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    Eh, I suppose, but the kingdom key seems very... Default. I mean, could you really imagine anything MORE basic?

    By the way, can you supply the star seeker picture in the battlefield?
     
  13. Trollfur Moogle Assistant

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    Well, yes. He does have key chains on his...... But i don't think the other ones are keyblades
     
  14. Twilight's Rose Banned

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    A keyblade doesn't need a keychain to be real. Keychain or not, is still a keyblade. All the things on the floor in the battle scene between MX and XA, ARE keyblades! It was confirm by seing those things close. Thats all I need to say.

    ^^Rose^^
     
  15. P Banned

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    What, may I ask, does XA stand for?

    Also, I have given up deigning that those things are not keyblades, but I still hold firm that they differ from the kingdom key, Way to the dawn, Mickey's key and the Keys of Master Xehanort and his apprentice.

    Also, please state your source that a keyblade lacking a keychain is equal to a Chained one. You can state an opinion as many times as you like, but that does not make it a fact.

    My reasons for thinking that they are lesser are:

    They lack a keychain, one of a keyblade's main properties.

    They have been seen to shatter. Yes, I know Sora has not been frozen and tossed off a cliff, but it seems as if Sora has had enough done to his keyblade. He cut buildings in half, he took a pounding by Roxas, yet no break.

    I was not impressed by the amount of magic they displayed. A keyblade seems to have a fair bit of magic in it, but the best I saw of Ven, Terra and Aqua was a reflectaga. No beam of light at kingdom hearts, nothing.

    There, those are my opinions, backed up with fact. Your turn.
     
  16. Illusionary Oblivion Merlin's Housekeeper

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    You know... the mere term 'chained' gives the impression of it being weaker -at least to me.

    Also, you missed out on a few spells... Aqua also cast a blizzard spell, or maybe it was a thunder... one of those two (or maybe both)... Besides, the boys don't seem the type to use magic all that often, from their fighting styles...
     
  17. P Banned

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    Yeah, the "chained" thought did occur, but I cannot think of anything else to say, and chained means keychained, not literal chains.

    Also, by magic I did not so mean "Firaga!" magic, but the "Tingle, click, I just sealed a world" magic. I mean as in what Sora does to the hearts of worlds. I sort of thought that Aqua would reach out and shoot kingdom hearts with her keyblade. I know that lack of this does not warrent me to scream "WEAKER!" but it is something to note, right?

    Ah meh. What else can I say? I just think that those blades are prototypes. I like my theory, it is the best I have seen so far, if that is not too egotistic to say.

    My theory deals with a few things.

    1. The lack of chains. Sorry to revisit this, but my theory of them being prototypes does explain the lack of chains.

    2. The shattering. This can be attributed to the spell, but I prefer to think of it as weakness in the blade.

    3. The sheer amount of the blades. I cannot get my head around over 9000 blades sitting in that place. if the blades are indeed real, then I think there is some mistake, as when Sora showed up, Leon acted at if he was Jesus. I doubt they would forget thousands of Wielders in ten years.

    There, those are my reasons.

    I really hope that my computer doesn't freeze when I try to post...
     
  18. Illusionary Oblivion Merlin's Housekeeper

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    There wasn't anything TO seal, in that sense...
     
  19. P Banned

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    Debatable.

    You could say that there was nothing to seal when Sora used his blade on the fake kingdom hearts, but he did it anyway (as well as in the last Xemnas battle).

    I know that is not the strongest point, but it still was a small point. I sort of thought someone would reach out and shoot Kingdom hearts.

    Ah well.

    I am still certain that even if my theory is wrong, there is SOME difference between the chained and unchained.
     
  20. Twilight's Rose Banned

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    MX= Master Xenahort

    XA= Xenahort's Apprentice

    And when youy the term, "chained" you make the keyblade sound weaker. But that I mean that it may be "chained", becuase it may have a deadly sleeping power withing it. Who knows, there was an ancient keyblade wielder mith, "The keyblade master uses the power for good or for destruction", come on, if Sora unleashes a strong power from the keyblade he might come crazy and desire to hold more power and destroy all the worlds. Everyone knows that in every game a good and trustful person turns evil and dirty because of experiencing a strong power that leads them to more hunger, by that phase, comes the other phase, the searching phase. This is where the evil one seeks motre power, he will destroy all thats in his path with no mercy. Sora might be affected by that.

    Wow! I never thought that by explaining a few things a long theory would appear! :0

    ^^Rose^^