Should the Minimum Wage Be Raised?

Discussion in 'Debate Corner' started by Boy Wonder, Feb 13, 2013.

?

The Minimum Wage Should...

  1. Be Raised

    5 vote(s)
    62.5%
  2. Be Lowered

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Be Abolished Altogether (let employers choose whatever wage)

    1 vote(s)
    12.5%
  4. Stay What It Currently Is

    2 vote(s)
    25.0%
  1. Boy Wonder Dark Phoenix in Training

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2008
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Genosha
    2,239
    For those of you who didn't watch the State of the Union Address (you're horrible Americans!), the President mentioned raising the minimum wage to $9.00. It is currently at $7.25. I want to know where you stand on this issue of minimum wage in general, this specific proposal of raising to 9 an hour, and why.
     
  2. Mysty Unknown

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Location:
    Unknown
    835
    Well, with inflation happening, it sort of needs to go up. Things are becoming more expensive due to these unnecessary stimulus packages increasing debt and thus governments printing more money. Happened with Zimbabwe. Wage is one of those things that depends on the economy, and sense the economy is doing poorly, more is going to be given. However, people will not give more because of how bad it is keepin it at either a stalemate or lowering it even which creates even more imbalance in the economy.
     
  3. Anixe Hollow Bastion Committee

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2007
    Location:
    Dim Sum Palace
    703
    725
    As currently unemployed, sure, I want a larger minimum wage. It hasn't been raised since they first established it way back when. It's supposed to allow the worker to be able to sustain a decent living (i.e., enough money to buy food and pay rent on a break-even basis) on the minimum wage, but obviously it's not really the case nowadays.

    However, on the other side, as far as I can tell, it will cause problems because such higher expenses for employees would hit them even harder in their profits (at least for some business owners). I think that's why a lot of people are kinda still reluctant to raise the minimum wage because it might hurt businesses even worse. Alas, $9.00 may be pushing it but hey, it's something.
     
  4. Misty gimme kiss

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Gender:
    Cisgender Female
    Location:
    alderaan
    6,590
    In economic terms, minimum wage is what's called a "price floor." If minimum wage is set above market equilibrium--that is, it is too high for most employers to pay--unemployment will increase, particularly in the unskilled or unexperienced. Following economic logic, raising the minimum wage will benefit those who get a raise (obviously), but will also lead companies to lay-off workers because they can't afford to keep as many, and will act as a barrier to those entering or re-enteringthe job market.

    For argument's sake, we'll follow Obama's suggestion of $9/hr, even if we're below living wage standards. That's about a 20% increase in cost per employee to employers. Small businesses and large businesses alike will feel this rather significant hit.While our economy is in recovery, unemployment is still a real problem and businesses are still slow to put up the Help Wanted sign out of an inability to support the wages of another employee.


    This all sounds pretty Republican up to now--time for me to go LIBERAL on y'all. prepare yrself.

    Our economy is controlled by big business. Ideally, a minimum wage will not be a price floor at all--it will be determined by a similar concept to supply & demand. An employer offers a job at $7.25/hr. No single adults can live on that income, and no one takes the job. The employer is left without an employee, and with no choice but to raise the hourly rate in order to attract an employee. However, this ideal situation does not take two things into account: first, unemployment. People are so desperate for work these days that they'll take jobs below minimum wage just to make some money, because some money is better than no money. Secondly, this is under the belief that we live in a pure capitalist system, not one where an unskilled worker's only options are places like Walmart, where they can put wages as low as possible because they employ such a large part of the population--people have nowhere else to go. In order to really heal the country's problems, we need to address our glaring economic problems. Minimum wage is a start, but things cannot drastically improve until we drastically reform.

    We are paid a minimum wage, not a living wage. An employee working 40 hours a week ( a full time job ) at $7.25/hr will make $15080/year. Following New York State tax rates ( just because that's where I live, we do have some of the highest taxes in the country, admittedly ), taxes will take out around $890 (rounded). That leaves $14190. One person can maybe scrape by on that, with belt loops pretty tight. To put it into perspective, New York State's official poverty level for a single person is $11500/year. Minimum wage is putting you just above poverty, essentially. And that's not considering benefits, which usually do not come with minimum wage jobs.
    Granted, New York City is a very expensive place to live. If you're curious, you can calculate a living wage where you live. I live in a rather expensive area of Long Island--living wage for a single adult here is placed at $13.03.

    The argument that businesses will not be able to financially justify hiring more employees, and may indeed lay some off, when minimum wage is increased is debunked when you consider that someone being paid a living wage--which is far above minimum wage--will have more money to spend on products, meaning more profit for businesses and a higher demand for employees.


    Sitting pretty far to the left of the political spectrum, the liberal business makes far more sense to me, but I think conservatives--most of whom will oppose Obama's plans--have validity to their argument. Unemployment will rise if this is implemented, but will drop off again once the long term effects ( more money in people's pockets -> more consumer spending ) take hold. People are wishing too hard for quick fixes to the economy, and are too afraid of the government interfering in the market. But these problems need to be addressed, and this is a start.

    Edit
    This all said, I've been working at the same place for two years (although I did quit for four months... then came back, all on good terms!). It's a small business so wages are lower than they would be elsewhere, but I make $7.95 (for real just give me one more nickel please). A dollar more would be... *u*
     
  5. The Twin My, what a strange duet

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2007
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    The Devil's Carnival
    143
    I'm going to jump in on top of Misty's post somewhat and share my own experiences. For reference, I live(d) in Massachusetts (I say lived because I'm overseas for the next year).

    My first real full-time job out of college was at a daycare in the city. Despite that said job required a minimum of a bachelor's degree just to get hired, I started at $8.50/hour. I worked from 8:30-5 Mon-Fri, sometimes getting overtime if there was a center meeting I had to attend or my coworker didn't come in, forcing me to stay late and close the classroom (often). But for the sake of some math I'm going to leave the overtime out of this. That's 7.5 hours, not including the hour lunch break. So 37.5 hours/week. Company considered that full time.

    I made $1275 a month, $15300 a year. By the end of the year at least 2k would be taken out in taxes both state and federal. So that leaves me with $13300. But state laws require residents to have health insurance or we get fined, so each monthly check saw me lose $200 between my health plan and dental plan. So that's another $2400 gone by the end of the year. Leaving me with $10900 for the year, around $900 a month.

    Now, let's go over some costs. The city I worked in was at best a 45 minute drive away. So and hour and a half each day, times 5. Even with a 36 mpg car, I needed a fuel up each week. Before I left for China prices were hovering around $3.68/gallon. Tank holds just about 12 gallons. So that's $44 a week. I never let my tank drop to E, so in reality I'd fill it with 7 gallons or perhaps 9. So more like $33 a week. Times that by 4, you get $132. Out of my $900 a month remainder, this would leave me with $768.

    Housing here is ridiculous. For a single room studio apartment with one bedroom and combined living spaces most would ask for a minimum of $600 a month and up, minus utilities and other fees like groundskeeping. An even smaller space (akin to a dorm room) start at $550 (By comparison, the place I have in China, a 1 bed room place with combined living and dining room, kitchen area and a full bathroom is being rented for the equivalent of $350/month). If I went with the $600 space, that leaves $168 to try and divide between food, electricity, water, heat, phone line, etc. Doable, but not easy. And because I made $15300 before all the cuts, I couldn't apply for assistance such as food stamps or housing assistance, because I was above the poverty line.

    Long story short, I worked there for two years, ended up staying home with my parents because I honestly couldn't afford to move out, built up a nest egg for myself, then fled to China when the opportunity arose.

    TL;DR - So if I could barely scrape by with less than a dollar tacked on to minimum wage (because I had a degree), then perhaps it is time for it to be raised again.
     
  6. A Zebra Chaser

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2013
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Canada
    1,953
    Canada has a higher minimum wage and it seems to be working.
    Honestly, in most cases businesses lay people off not because they can't afford it, but because they can't afford it while staying as ridiculously profitable.
     
  7. Loxare Hollow Bastion Committee

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Gender:
    No
    Location:
    Flower Field
    906
    659
    Only $7.25? Alberta has $9.75 (I think) currently and it's been going up. We've had quite a few increases over the past few years, although they've never been more than a quarter or so. And even that much seems small to most people who live here. Since America seems to be having so much difficulty with poverty, it's probably a good idea to increase minimum wage. However, this could lead to corporations saying that they "can't pay their workers" after the new expenditure increase and could lead to layoffs.

    I guess what I'm saying is, yes, increase minimum wage, but do it slowly so the corporations can't say that the increase was a shock to their funds and they can't pay it.
     
  8. Technic☆Kitty Hmm

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    1,299
    If it raises any higher it'll only hurt the economy worse. Employers won't employ as many people so they don't have to pay as much, unemployment rate inclines, the economy plummets. It's quite simple to see that an increase in the given situation is a terribly bad idea. Similar to taxes, in that taxes should not be lowered. It's bad enough trying to find a decent road where I live as it is.

    At any rate, sure some might get a good kick out of a raise, but all the people who lose their jobs aren't going to. I'd rather keep my job, thank you. I suppose letting employers choose wouldn't be so bad, but I don't work for nickels and dimes which would more or less be what they'd like to pay you. Honestly, they'd like to pay you as little as possible. There are some pro's and con's with that path, but I disagree with it so I won't go into detail.

    Raise of minimum wage is a bad idea.

    EDIT: Raises given for a long term employment or a promotion are fine by my book. ^^
     
  9. Sara Tea Drinker

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2006
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Wherever the wind takes me.
    340
    I have to say that raising the minimum wage is a good idea. The problem right now is that in most states the wage is WAY too low for people to survive off it. I know at least at Wal-Mart and other place that the people who work at least forty hours a week have food stamps and other things to support their families. It might hurt some businesses, but at the same time, the money that is going out will go back to the business because people will be able to afford more to buy more stuff long term.
     
  10. Boy Wonder Dark Phoenix in Training

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2008
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Genosha
    2,239
    Are you implying that everyone should stay at the rate at which they're hired, as long as they're in the same position? If not, disregard the rest of this post. Employers giving people raises (I'm entitled, but not guaranteed one a year at my current job, depending on my annual evaluations) means it's less money they have to pay others, similar to raising the minimum wage. So should wage increases only be given for promotions, if even that?
     
  11. Darkandroid Gets it Together

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    240
    Misty has shown both sides of it pretty well. A lot of what she said I agree with.

    The fact it hasn't change since 2009 means that it should go up, just simply because of inflation. Every year it stays the same, the less that salary is worth compared to the cost of living. Really making huge jumps like this is a bad idea. It should be done yearly like it is here in the UK. It means the burden of increased salaries for businesses is less. Like Misty said a 20% increase will make a huge impact. But if it was done gradually over 4 years then it won't seem as drastic and is something businesses will always plan for because they expect it.

    Oddly enough this week our government announced an increase in minimum wage from £6.19 to £6.31. An increase that is once again below the rate of inflation, something that they have been doing for the past few years. So in comparison an increase to $9 is really generous. (In 2009 our minimum wage was £5.80. So in 4 years it has only gone up by 51p, which in kind of pathetic.) I assume they have picked that $9 figure so that it can still be considered decent in a few years time.