Space programme or Starving people

Um. Do you have any idea how many people live in Africa?

Do you have any idea how much it would cost the US to even try and feed a fraction of those people? We're already a gazillion dollars in debt, but, I think you'd go, "Oh well maybe it was worth it." if NASA found a new planet/star/discovered new life. :|

Charity is a good thing. But, there's a limit to how much charity you can do. Throwing away an entire space program, because you want to feed the poor however, is a bad idea.

 

i may sound cruel but if all the poor people died off now, there wouldn't be any poor people...

 

...

 

Morally it would be better to help everyone so we all be happy individuals.

However, in politics, space program ftw.

 

Actually, quite a few countries have had -less- births in the later generations than former ones. America's last big population growth was the baby boomers' time. Since many people nowadays work etc, birth rates have been lower in the U.S., Europe and Japan. China has a 1 kid law so their populations will also be thinned out but really India and China have the biggest population issues anymore. There is some overpopulation going on in the world but mostly it is from former generations that are now people aged 50+ and not so much with those after that.

Also, I still see a ton of programs and also people who go out of their way to donate things. Governments also respond to threats and go out of their way for lesser fortunate nations. We are a very giving people despite how rotten some people try to make others look. We don't really -owe- anyone money or medicines or clothes we donate to give them etc. Many of us do it out of the kindness of our hearts. The space program has helped us also in a ton of ways and is not just about sending people up in a rocket. It has also taught us much about weather and predicting storms to get aid to others faster, offered up better communications we use constantly and take for granted, helped with packaging food and medicines better and many other things. It is to our advantage to not just stifle our technological advances in other areas just because we want to go help the poor. I'm sorry but the space program is not the problem and people that bring it up really don't see all of the common day advantages we have gotten from having it.

Yes, I hate the concept that people starve but we cannot help -everyone- even if we had the money to. People need to learn and do things as well for themselves. We donate a ton of money, food, clothing, meds, nets, etc to those who are less fortunate. It helps some and others just become dependent on it and then put others down because they are interfering in their lives etc. There is a lot of benevolence in people and we can't do everything, no matter what. Killing off advantages of science to aid us better all around seems like the dumbest idea in the world to resolving issues of poverty etc. We wouldn't be able to help them as much as we do now were it not for advances in science in a number of areas, not just food and drugs. This is the beauty of it all is that more than one field of expertise has enabled us to do so much more for ourselves so why would I want to sacrifice it? Makes no sense at all.

 

The main problem today is that money is thrown about and therefore wasted. The government pours "aid" money in, but doesn't research where it is actually going. Most of the time the aid doesn't even get through because of the corrupt government and/or militias (I'd say most of Africa's governments are heavily corrupt and couldn't be trusted with the simplest of tasks >_>).

When people see that the government is giving X million here and X million there it makes them feel better, even if it doesn't actually help anyone. This being the main reason why I often don't give to charity. Why should I give my money if I don't know exactly where it is going and if it is actually going to help people?

This being why I think that tangible results are much more important than any "feel good" factor.

 

I would agree with you there which is why if I do send to charity I try to ensure I know where it's going. However, if I can help out people in my area, I prefer to do that because I can actually see for true what I am doing with the money and what that person is. I have no problem donating my clothes I don't want or food cans etc but money to me is something that I'd actually make sure goes to the people who need it instead of some religious group bosses or corporate bosses so that they can sit back and get fat and drive expensive cars while those people who are starving to death get far less than they should. I still do now and then donate to other places but mostly with actual food and clothing and other items rather than money if I can help it. There have been way too many scams and if some get pointed out you know there's bound to be a ton more.

 

Space program.

You don't seem to understand the basis of the space programs most major countries are funding nowadays. They aren't started so we can fly through space, they are started for scientific research and the study of other planets. Being in space changes the way physics, chemistry and other sciences work, so experiments in space can lead to different results. Also, we are starting to find a lot indicators that water exists on Mars (rocks that look like they were eroded, the presence of silicon which rarely forms without water, etc.). so space programs do indeed have their uses.

As for helping developing countries, I would say that the scientific possibilities of space programs are more important right now.

That's going a bit overboard.

 

I'd say lower the funds on Space Program and use those to raise the amount of aid support to foreign countries.

Personally, space exploration has been going quite slow. As far as discoveries go, anything mite be important but we haven't really got onto something too "astronomical" or above the norm. So I don't see the harm in extending research for an extra 4-5 years. Sure the tech ppls will get fairly impatient, but the starving ppl have wait all their lives for a decent meal. So honestly, those ppl up in the space agent needs to lower their heads from the clouds a bit and just grow some balls to donate like 10k of their 1 billion research fund to the poor and the needy.

Same goes for the gov. though. They need to get their lazy butt of their nice leather couches watching golf every half hour and start paying attention where all the aid money goes. This will be very pointless if in the end we found out that all our aid cash was given to some corperate dude whose got more than enough on his hands. It's quite dispicable at that POV.

 

I don't know how well space programs are funded in other countries, but in the U.S., we are currently not giving it very much money at all. Even if you took all of the space program money from the U.S. it wouldn't feed too many people. It definitely wouldn't feed an entire developing country.

 

I never mentioned it was mainly for space travel, all I meant is that we can only travel across our own solar system, anywhere else would be dangerous and too costly. So we are limited to our own part of space, what I mean is what happens after we discover everything e can on this side of the galaxy? We won't need a Space Programme (unless we discover some way in which to travel across the universe more easily). Not to mention we have more pressing issues that effects the Space Programme to, like resources of metal and fuel, not to mention the cost of those materials. Our efforts could be spent much better in other places.

Well it is true, you can't deny that.

 

Like I said earlier, we're putting very little money into the space program in the U.S. Taking money form it would do very little for any group of people.

Yes, and it's also an extremely sickening thought.

 

The space program isn't -that- big of a hog on costs. Really if you wanted more money for poor people of our own, let alone other people, we'd quit the war on drugs and apply manpower to better procedures, medicines and doing more work to help others. The space program has nothing to do with our state in not being able to help the poor out. We -need- scientific research and we would have nothing without it. The space program helps us do so many tasks even on our world and receives not that much as other things do.

Also, it's fine to feel sorry for people etc but we cannot help everyone out. Even if we had the money there is no way to help everyone; especially to learn to help -themselves-. There are people who take money from the mouths of others all the time. There is a corruption with people who apply for welfare, food stamps, illnesses and injury support SSI etc. We can't help our own people because of idiots who have messed things up and lied and get free money for no reason other than they are lazy. Our disabled and mentally disabled people suffer and don't get what they should now that all this bureaucracy is in the way that only corrupted jerks know how to get through. Overseas, money sent to people does not always get where it should whether through 'reputable' donation services or not. Also, some governments take the money and pocket it. People overseas also work out scams with people in Europe and America to do credit card scams and all sorts of things with our donated money to help the poor. Medicine doesn't always get where it should and is ceased.

Really, I think this is a lame thing to say the space program being reduced would help in any way at all and we -need- the space program as it assists us also with weather monitoring and also watching for asteroids etc, monitoring our communications networks and satellites etc. I'm sorry you find it so needless, PAW but I just do not feel it is a fair substitute in the end. People will starve no matter what. If people want to do something about it, they can donate some time and volunteer like I do. Education and knowledge are part of how we progress in life and I don't think knowledge should be sacrificed. There are far many other things that if a bunch of conservative people would stop being so **** over, could be changed and we'd have money to help the poor and also others in our society more efficiently and have more money to donate around the world. You do however miss the point that we donate TONS of money every year. Maybe Europe doesn't but I sincerely doubt that's true. In America we donate stuff ALL the time whether by our own deeds of buying things etc or by corporate programs or by sending money where it needs to go or doing volunteer work etc. There is more donated to help the poor than the space program costs, definitely. Cutting the space program is about as efficient as making people stop playing video games because that money could be spent on poor people who are starving. Joy kills really take the joy out of helping other people and letting people find easier ways of doing so. That's all this is to me.

 

I do not actually know any figures of the funding for Space Programme. Though I think I should take back giving it to other poor countries. It could be used in other ways, but all I mean too say is it still seems like a waste of money, whether the fund is large or small, it seems almost pointless, though I guess only results it gives can show us if it's worth it or not.

It only matter how you see the world, my friend.

 

PAW, why is it pointless? I don't think you really see all the advances we have gained through space examination and the space program. It's not just about sending people up in rockets. We have countless other uses the program is used for that directly affect how we view our world.

 

I don't know for sure. To me it seems humanity is distracted by so much, from money and discipline to power and greed, from suffering and disease to anger and lust.
We search the stars for answers to many questions and problems, when all we need to do is look around us, the stars won't be going anywhere, we can go back to space in the future, for now we need to sort out the problems before we start an adventure in the vaccum of space.

To explain my point i'm gonna say this, the world is like a a dirrty and broken gun, we are ready to use this gun in its worst conditions to shoot at pointles targets, we need to fix and clean this gun, find our priorities on what target we should aim at then shoot towards it.
I hope this makes some sense, and so rry for the gun references at the moment,it just is the greatest example i can think of.

 

Well, let me explain some of the benefits of the Space Program to show you that it is not just a frivolous waste of money, PAW, because seriously, there are many things we've gained from it.

- Programs are available around the world such as the Olympics can be viewed anywhere in the world via satellite because of the space program. This means that even very poor nations can get people to a TV set and watch the Olympics and their people. Some other events such as this are world televised and this is due to the space program effort.

- Cordless tools were developed for space and to make things easier on astronauts but we also have been able to use them for civilian life. Drills and such are quite common now. Also battery chargers for the devices were created. We even power our cell phones etc with battery chargers and a lot of other hand held devices commonly used. These batteries also have a longer life than typical batteries so it's better for the environment.

- Smoke detectors were created by NASA to help keep things safe in space and get people to know if there was a problem. Now nearly every European and American house owns one and several other places also have the luxury of it. A simple device that has saved countless lives.

- Water filters to purify water, attached to sinks and such were developed using NASA technology. This has cleaned up a lot of water that otherwise no one would want to drink and filters out lead, chlorine and nasty smells etc. It also means people don't have to go afford bottled water. These purifiers have also been used by countries that have contaminated water and the military has installed them in places for people such as in Rwanda when dead bodies were floating in their rivers.

- Improved insulation for homes was also taken from NASA technology that was used to make space craft insulated. Houses now are often sprayed with foam insulation that works quite well.

- Laser surgery such as laser heart surgery, lasik surgery etc are all related to NASA technology that was given to benefit people. Laser surgery is far less invasive and more precise, giving better chances to people to live and with less scarring. Also surgery so precise that was used to detect Ozone layer stuff is now used to be able to break up artery clogging.

- Biopsies for testing cancer are much more precise using telescope technology such as that found in the Hubble telescope. A needle can be used for it instead of a scalpal and now scarring is reduced dramatically. The sample is also less and causes far less discomfort.

- CAT scans and MRIs are both from NASA technology incorporated into medicine. Prosthetics (fake limbs) were improved dramatically with the help of NASA technology as well, which using the special foam and construction worked much better for maneuverability and such than the former prosthetics. Also they are far more functional and let a person feel much more free and they are much more durable, lasting years with more rigorous activity.

- Those thermometers for ears and mouths that do it in mere seconds are developed from NASA technology that is used to tell temperatures on worlds etc. LED technology is also inspired by NASA technology. A lot of digital technology is inspired from NASA technology.

- Virtual reality is from NASA configurations and technology which has helped with games we play and also with scientific programs for archeology, rebuilding lost civilizations etc and also is used in criminal science to build facial images etc.

- Special packagings of food to keep them more fresh, refrigeration improved methods, more 'green' methods for heating and ice have been developed through NASA technology. Also, weather programs, monitoring hurricane patterns, etc have been done through NASA tech. We also have to watch some asteroids that do come close to our world and well figure out if there is a natural disaster that could transpire from the courses of some that come by.


There are more as well but these are some of the major contributions from NASA technology and what they develop they do share with science quite often. We get countless benefits from it to aid us in our homes, hospitals, and the world at large. I hope this shows more why I am all for keeping the space program because really we do not put much money into it and I cannot find so many benefits to be frivolous.

 

But that's the problem, we make so amny new technologies, but we need something to power them, fuel sources are decreasing that all that stuff will be useless once we have nothing to power it with. THe more we build to improve our lives in the short run, the harder it will be in the long run for us.

I can understand where your coming from when you say life has become a little bit easier with new discoveries, but we won't have an easy life, not if global warming keeps happening, if we waste petroleum, if we throw away every non-biodegradable piece of equipment away. We will be eventually left with nothing to use, to help build our world, all I want humanity to do is conquer these problems first before we tackle technological issues like the space programme, not just that but every other technological task in the world.

 

Well that's not the argument at hand. The point of this discussion was whether or not we should put our funds from the space program towards feeding the needy. And I think Repliku has many valid points here.

 

Well this is difficult. I believe in saving lives but what if we save them, only to have them destroyed later on in life? Buying funding Space programs, we are capable of finding new things that could probably help both poor and rich people.
But then, we still have to feed people so they can enjoy this new technology we will eventually discover. But if we don't feed them, they die. Yet, when you think about it, why should we get involved in such matters? We're we the ones to cause these countries grief? I don't think so, yet, it is still our responsibility to keep them alive.
In total, I do believe we should fund space programs but still, we should have some money that should benefit those in need.