What is up with issues related to guns?

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Iskandar, Oct 12, 2015.

  1. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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    Well, yet another school in Oregon has suspended a child because of a shirt. You know, I understand their reason for doing it, but it's still shallow thinking on their part.

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/or...-shirt-showing-gun/ar-AAflijQ?ocid=spartandhp


    How many people nowadays don't understand that it's the person that uses the tool that makes the tool bad? Not too mention the meaning behind the shirt the kid was wearing. If it was just a simple gun without anything, I'd maybe side a little more with the school, but some on, this kid was wearing a short honoring our military for crying out loud.


    Another strange thing happened at an Olive Garden where a police officer was kicked out, celebrating his birthday no less, just because he had his duty firearm on him. Come on people, what the hell?

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/mo...ecause-of-duty-gun/ar-AAflpTR?ocid=spartandhp
     
  2. libregkd -

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  3. Laurence_Fox Chaser

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    It seems to be the issue of the gun and not knowing that gun pointed downwards + helmet + boots is a memorial to fallen soldiers. I know that the schools I went to had a dress code where we couldn't wear depictions of guns. [ And really no graphics at all midway through high school. ] But it seems a little extreme to suspend him over it. Couldn't they have given him a warning or something first? [ I know in high school we had 'conduct points'. And I think I only got 1 during my entire 4 years because I left my backpack in the hall in front of my locker. ] They could at least have offered the option to turn it inside out or something.

    But it is nice to see the kid sticking to his guns for a good cause.
     
  4. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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  5. libregkd -

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  6. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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  7. libregkd -

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  8. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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  9. Boy Wonder Dark Phoenix in Training

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    I'm torn on this.
    About whether or not he was on duty: if he wasn't, then he shouldn't have the gun issued for duty. Whether or not he ends up needing it, it's a misuse of work equipment and, from what I know about cops' jobs, a crap ton of paperwork if anything happens. However, the article mentioned that he was uniformed which makes me think he was working. If he was simply taking a lunch break to eat with family for his birthday, then I can see why he wouldn't leave his weapon unattended especially if he was in uniform. I don't think he was putting off his job just by eating birthday lunch with his family; it could have been a simple lunch break celebration because he had to work the rest of the day. I'm willing to bet that in those cases, cops are required to be able to "jump back into action" if they get a call. I've seen it happen more than once in the restaurant business; a cop orders and then has to leave before finishing because they get a call. I've seen it happen to firefighters, too. Olive Garden should have handled it differently, though. Complaining they're being persecuted against, however, is just bullshit.
    I want to point out what's wrong with this statement: The police are persecuting the other groups and then complaining when they don't get their way. You aren't being persecuted because you have to follow the same rules as everyone else. Not applying that to this specific instance, just saying that cops complaining about being "persecuted" is like someone complaining that we have to remove the Ten Commandments from a state capitol. Not to mention all of the cases of police brutality recently, especiallythe race related ones.


    As to the kid with the shirt: the school ****ed up. Look, I'm all for much heavier gun regulation, but getting students in trouble for a shirt honoring soldiers is not the way to do it. I understand that it's the gun culture that needs to change, but this school did not help the cause.
     
  10. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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    You think police are the only ones that persecute others and complain when things don't go their way?
     
  11. Boy Wonder Dark Phoenix in Training

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    Umm, no. But bringing in the instances of the other groups is off-topic. If you're implying that other groups doing it makes it okay, then no, it doesn't. If you're just asking if I -for some reason- think it's just cops doing it, then no; the other groups and their situations aren't part of this discussion.
     
  12. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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    You're missing my point. I asked you about the other groups because in the end, every single one of them is whining about stuff being done to them and not being able to do the same back. They're all acting like children, and should just figure things out without complaining. I agree that these guys are going on about how this cop is being persecuted, and I find it incredibly dumb, but at the same time, I find what the Olive Garden did to him to be dumb as well. Once this became a whole thing of "cop was persecuted, we're going to make a big fiasco of this", it went overboard; the fact that the president of Olive Garden himself apologized says as much to me.

    And this kind of stuff happens all over, but we only see a small amount of it, and it always seems centered on a certain group of people.
     
  13. libregkd -

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  14. Iskandar King of Conquerors

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  15. tamale Ice to see you!

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    I can't blame Oregon for being jumpy about gun-related stuff right now, but the shirt was definitely an overreaction.

    I'm with Bueno on the police thing; it really depends on if he was on duty or not, which does not seem entirely clear. If he was on duty, there's no problem with him having a gun on his person. If he was off-duty, he should not have brought it into the restaurant.

    America has this terrible, toxic gun fetish that it refuses to let go of, and I'm exhausted by it. As I once saw a Twitter user say, though, the gun argument was over as soon as it decided that the slaughter of elementary school children was bearable.
    You mean like protesting? Marching in Washington, D.C.? Raising awareness of injustices they have faced and educating on the issues they do face? Holding accountable those police officers and others who have wronged them? Like they've been doing?
     
  16. libregkd -

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  17. Patman Bof

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    A while back I wondered how you police your police in the US and didn' t get much of an answer.
    I stumbled upon this a few days ago : http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/internal-affairs-police-misconduct_5613ea2fe4b022a4ce5f87ce

    While I agree that violence shouldn' t be your go to answer and that there are other ways to show that you do mean business, as bloody as it was the French revolution did work. Just sayin ...

     
  18. Menos Grande Kingdom Keeper

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    Even though I agree with you at a philosophical level every tool has a "intent behind it", a primary use. Guns aren't bad, but they are made for killing people, sure you can use it for "good", but only because there are guns out there in the first place we need guns to control its wielders. It is different than any other tool that can be used as a weapon, but have a primary use that is "harmless". I am not taking the responsibility of the person using the tool, I am not saying that having a gun makes you automatically evil, but I take it with a grain of salt when someone say that guns were made neutral and almost pious.
    As for the use of weapons by cops off duty, the legislation changes from place to place so I'll speak of my opinion of what is right and not "legal", and even though in some cops do need them even off duty, I think it should be kept at a minimum, off duty cops are civilians therefore the presence of a gun changes their position/power/ and awareness of others around him.